FGC5494

Moderator: Tim Fitzpatrick

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mikefitz
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Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:43 pm

The place to discuss haplotype FGC5494.
Tim Fitzpatrick
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Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:18 pm

FGC5494 is a single nucleotide polymorphism (SNP). It is reported as being circa 2400BC. Mike Walsh has a project at Family Tree DNA (FTDNA) with a SNP tree which is for R1b-L21 haplogroup men who have tested their yDNA. Mike is the administrator of this project. FGC5494 is placed in this tree. Many of the Fitzpatricks who have tested yDNA are also in differing parts of this SNP tree.
I hope we can have more of the Laois and Kilkenny Fitzpatricks to test past their most commonly reported haplogroup of R-M269. They could upgrade with a FGC5494 SNP pack, STR111, and or a BigY test. By doing so we can bring the group into better focus and at the same time bring the terminal haplogroups into the more recent past when surnames become the norm.
Tim

Another project at FTDNA is the FGC5494 and Subclades project. I find myself joining as many projects as I can that are relevant for my surname, ethnicity, haplogroups and terminal SNP. I believe the more the merrier.
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mikefitz
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Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:42 am

Tim we all know what an important group FGC5494 is. We need to get our heads together and figure out a strategy for further testing. I'm sure we can find some funds rot regularly test FGC5494 Fitzpatricks for key SNPs, such as A1487 and/or A1488, because the tests are only USD39 at FTDNA.
Tim Fitzpatrick
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Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:03 pm

Mike,
I believe two people have decided to do the FGC5494 SNP pack test. I am excited about this. I think it is a great offer for the Clan Society to fund some testing.

If there is anyone interested or if anyone knows of a good candidate please let me know.

Tim
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mikefitz
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Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:48 pm

Tim if you find the candidates the Society will fund one SNP test per month for them. I think A1488 is the way to go for now because you and Fitzgerald share that. One there are a few more BigYs in there that might change though.
Tim Fitzpatrick
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Wed Oct 17, 2018 1:01 am

Robert Fitzpatrick has his results returned for the BigY.
Thanks to the project for the gift to Robert and the chance to see how the Ossory Fitzpatrick's are connected.
Robert's results have confirmed that the FGC5494 SNP is a branch SNP that is common for the Ossory DNA group. These are brave words.
But we also have Peggy Fitzpatrick and Richard Costigan returning FGC5494 SNP pack tests that indicate the same result.
The DNA testing at 37 STR markers is showing a connection. That is old testing and I submit out of date. It would be good if all the members of the Fitzpatrick DNA project could upgrade their results as cost permits. Mike , Ian and myself are good to discuss how best to spend monies for the best result.
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mikefitz
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Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:29 pm

An updated FGC5494>... A1487 haplotree is available:

http://www.fitzpatrickclan.org/Ossory%2 ... Matrix.jpg
Tim Fitzpatrick
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Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:31 pm

FGC5494 Newsletter July 2019

Sorry folks there should be a diagram here I will work out to add it.

Hello to the Fitzpatrick Sept,
Here is an update that speaks to the recent Y DNA testing. In the particular we are discussing the FGC5494 group or Laois/Kilkenny or Ossory group. Above is a screen shot from FTDNA’s BigY Block Tree. The discussion to follow is applicable to all the DNA groups in the Fitzpatrick Project. Please note that the screen shot dose not give the full sequence of SNPs (single nucleotide polymorphisms) between R-FGC7448 and R-A1488. As well the BigY Block Tree at FTDNA is a tool that comes with BigY testing. Please consider an upgrade of your Y DNA to a BigY test to avail yourself of this tool. The people listed in the block tree have taken a BigY test. They all sit under and branch from their common ancestor SNP of R-A1488. These people share a common male ancestor who processed this SNP R-A1488. These people triangulate back to R-A1488. Their pedigrees triangulate back to R-A1488. Can a DNA triangulation and a documented pedigree triangulation be synonymous. The answer is yes. Which triangulation has the best veracity to support a common ancestor. The answer is DNA testing. Will a documented pedigree be accurate. The answer is yes. But a documented pedigree can be proved to be inaccurate by DNA testing,
Back to the BigY Block Tree above; two people in the block can claim a documented ancestry to the first Baron of Upper Ossory. The BigY DNA testing supports their pedigree. Therefore, the two triangulations are synonymous. The common SNP is R-A1488 which the First Baron had. The Baron was born in 1485AD. Most likely he was born with R-A1488 because the two people in the BigY Block Tree descend from separate male lines. R-A1488 can not be any younger than 1485AD. It could be older if it originated in an ancestor of the First Baron.
Next Generation Sequencing (NGS) used in the BigY gives SNPs that build a tree. A Pedigree with fourteen / fifteen generations is a rare resource. Combining these two things produces a very powerful tool to help understand how people in the project are connected. We have a lot to thank Ronan and Steve for in compiling their book about the First Baron.
R-A1488 has come to light as more people have taken the BigY test. The sequence of SNPs has moved from FGC5494 > FGC5561 > FGC7448 > FGC5496 > FGC5512 > FGC5549 > FGC5511 > A1487 > A1506 > A1496 to A1488. R-A1488 is a characteristic of the Ossory Fitzpatrick group. FGC5494 was the SNP to connect to the STR markers DYS390=21 and YCAII=22-23; then A1487. But now R-A1488 is the SNP to connect with the STR markers DYS390=21 and YCAII=22-23. You can test individual SNPs or do a BigY. The FGC5494 SNP pack test only tests to A1487. We are waiting on FTDNA to add more SNPs downstream from A1487. Ideally we would like to find more branches under R-A1488. To do that we would need more people to take a BigY700.
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mikefitz
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Mon Jul 29, 2019 1:16 pm

Fitzpatrick DNA Project Update for Group 2 – July 2019

I am very pleased to provide an update of the DNA project that relates to our Groups 2G-2L, which are sub-groups of Group 2A. The latter is sometimes referred to simply as ‘Ossory Fitzpatricks’ although Groups 2A and S2G-2L also contain members with other surnames, most notably Costigan and FitzGerald.

The recent flood of BigY data has provided us with much greater confidence that a single mutation known as A1488 marks the common ancestry of ‘Ossory Fitzpatricks’ and that Group 2A members who have not undertaken NGS (Next-Generation Sequencing) tests will most likely possess this mutation.

A rigorous analysis of data from 13 men who have the A1488 mutation has found they share common ancestry from ca.1250 AD. Around that time annalistic records note Séafraid (Geoffrey) Mac Giolla Phádraig was ‘King of Slieve Bloom’. Geoffrey sired at least three sons, Geoffrey, William and Oistegan, and from the latter is derived the surname Costigan. Remarkably, one of the A1488 men is a Costigan, corroborating historical records and pointing the finger firmly in the direction of Geoffrey senior as the progenitor of the ‘Ossory Fitzpatricks’.

The line of Geoffrey, son of Geoffrey, became that of the Barons of Upper Ossory. One A1488 man on the DNA study can show descent from Barnaby Fitzpatrick, the 1stBaron of Upper Ossory, and although he possesses the mutation shared by others, his additional mutations indicates he is, so far, quite unique. It is likely other Fitzpatricks on the DNA study have additional shared ancestry at least two to four generations earlier than Barnaby, perhaps back even as far as William, son of Geoffrey.

These findings are a great example of how DNA can confirm some of the histories recorded by Irish scholars. However, at the same time a deeper analysis of data from Ossory Fitzpatricks is challenging those very same histories. It is considered implausible that Geoffrey was the descendant of Irish clansmen in the 10thCentury, at the time the Mac Giolla Phádraig clan emerged. Rather, Ossory Fitzpatricks bear an earlier genetic signature from ca. 920 AD, and have a broader genetic profile, which is more consistent with a non-Irish, continental origin – perhaps Norman, or Viking, or from an isolated clan of Gaels.

The field of genetic genealogy is extremely dynamic and a single future DNA result might alter the theories presented here. But that does not mean we will not advance what we consider to be the best supported theories at any given point in time.

We hope this update provides a focus for some healthy discussion and, additionally, encourages those who haven’t taken any NGS tests to consider doing so. There are various options available at FTDNA, from a quite affordable single mutation test to the more pricy BigY-700.

And on that note, genetic testing in Group 2 has been facilitated in no small part thanks to generous financial contributions, including those from Tim Fitzpatrick (Australia) and the Fitzpatrick Clan Society. Data analysis was conducted by Dr Mike Fitzpatrick (New Zealand), Ian Fitzpatrick (Canada) and Tim Fitzpatrick (Australia).

Mike Fitzpatrick PhD
Administrator – Fitzpatrick DNA Project
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